Curse

Kranas · Sep 07, 2010, 11:20 PM // 23:20

To all those QQing about not getting into groups in PUGs because there are too many SoS rits...I've often had success, in particular with the zaishen missions/bountys by advertising as a restoration rit. Groups themselves often say lf monk/resto rit because the monks get snapped up fast. Just because a resto rit might not be up to a UA/HB monks standards doesn't mean you can't try to adapt abit and meet the demand.

Also setting up spirits is pretty brainless...But so is a bunch of other builds. Also spirits don't exactly steamroll through high end or certain types of mobs in PvE, specially if they are being smacked with AoE without something like AoU.

Voodoo Rage · Sep 07, 2010, 11:29 PM // 23:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaquin

Before spirit spamming, you had to run with a minion master. They are high energy, highly spec'd, have lengthy cast times (lagging behind) and require corpses to work. Spirits are cheap, fast, quickly replaceable, come out of thin air and any secondary can run it. That, right there, is OP. Ignore the farms, it displaced much of the fun and challenge of the game.

I think a reasonable nerf to spirits would be to lower their health and make them easier to kill. I don't think spirits were ever intended to act as a "wall" to absorb damage. The pre-buffed spirits worked actually quite well, it's just the cast times were ridiculous. This would make a spirit wrangler truly need to manage the placement of their spirits and keep them out of danger.

kyzia diera · Sep 08, 2010, 01:19 AM // 01:19

best to quit whining about it and wait for GW2, you dont like SoS then simply dont play it, you could H/H everything in the game if it really came down to it. but there is no use whining about it. every game you play will have a part about it that is OP, if you manage to find one without one then congrats you rediscovered pong...

Horus Moonlight · Sep 08, 2010, 02:26 AM // 02:26

Of all the things that are op/game-breaking that need to be fixed and SoS is a priority?

Lishy · Sep 08, 2010, 03:03 AM // 03:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by veteran_player

I been gone all summer and I came back to find that the game is deader than ever......

Ursan and Shadowform killed it for the majority , but there are still some people around......

Seriously isn't it time to say enough is enough......

There is no one out playing in mission zones anymore....

The only place you can hope to get a group is in the daily Z-mission area......

...........and you can't play there either because there are always 7 million sos rits waiting to play for you......

Can't we just have gameplay back for a little while........?

Please ?

What does SoS have to do with all this? Were you not sober when you made this thread?

Lanier · Sep 08, 2010, 03:33 AM // 03:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horus Moonlight

Of all the things that are op/game-breaking that need to be fixed and SoS is a priority? It's threads like these that make me wonder if there is an aura of idiocy that pervades the PvE community.

What is more OP in the general pve setting in your opinion?

Quote:

best to quit whining about it and wait for GW2, you dont like SoS then simply dont play it, you could H/H everything in the game if it really came down to it. but there is no use whining about it. every game you play will have a part about it that is OP, if you manage to find one without one then congrats you rediscovered pong...

...I dont get it... Thats no reason not to nerf an OP skill.

Lishy · Sep 08, 2010, 03:55 AM // 03:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanier

...I dont get it... Thats no reason not to nerf an OP skill.

Because it is a fun build that has opened up numerous builds without being overly dominant in the meta-game, as a Ritualist can run other builds as well. However, the ease of use and sheer variety possible in SoS builds allows it to be an invaluable tool since the Ritualist buff. Nerfing it will kill off a very important aspect that defines the modern day Ritualist however.

Now, can we get a reason that it SHOULD be nerfed? Or are you just trolling us? Or are there people seriously still rambling on about nerfing skills that would only hurt PvE?

Besides being a flat-out game breaker like SF and Ursan were, the only way to truly define a reason to nerf in PvE is to prevent monsters from becoming too hard, and challenging. Hypothetically, say all Mesmers could spam 90 dmg skills in PvE every few seconds. That would be a pain in the ass, would it not?

Perfected Shadow · Sep 08, 2010, 04:00 AM // 04:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by veteran_player

The only place you can hope to get a group is in the daily Z-mission area......

...........and you can't play there either because there are always 7 million sos rits waiting to play for you......

Can't we just have gameplay back for a little while........?

Please ?

What the hell are you running that groups would rather bring 8 SoS rits than add you?

Daesu · Sep 08, 2010, 04:02 AM // 04:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfected Shadow

What the hell are you running that groups would rather bring 8 SoS rits than add you?

Why would a group be so dumb as to bring 8 SoS rits?

Doesn't anyone know that bringing 2 of the same spirits would cancel out?

Lishy · Sep 08, 2010, 04:07 AM // 04:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daesu

Why would a group be so dumb as to bring 8 SoS rits?

Doesn't anyone know that bringing 2 of the same spirits would cancel out?

That is the point. Someone's build has to be REALLY bad if a second SoS is chosen over the guy who gets kicked

Aycee · Sep 08, 2010, 07:12 AM // 07:12

No, just no. I don't even own a ritualist and I don't mind Spirits. If you were able to summon the same spirits multiple times then there would be a legitimate reason to need a nerf. But the way it is now is fine.

StormX · Sep 08, 2010, 08:27 AM // 08:27

That's 7 million sos rits looking for 7 million pugs. If you can't even get one of those pugs to take you....well.. are you playing a dervish? or a mending wammo?

YunSooJin · Sep 08, 2010, 08:43 AM // 08:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horus Moonlight

Of all the things that are op/game-breaking that need to be fixed and SoS is a priority?

look at the inane drivel on the frontpage of riverside. wonder? .... there have been countless of threads where the complaints of a vocal and persistent minority have constantly overshadowed the fact that most of us either don't care or don't think its a problem.

Star_Jewel · Sep 08, 2010, 10:11 AM // 10:11

It seems to me that whenever we see a majority of a certain class, people start screaming "OMG! Overpowered! Nerf! Nerf!" At least that's the vibe I got pre-SF-"nerf" -- that all anybody ever saw in outposts were assassins.

Maybe it's just that, while spirits took 2 seconds to cast, everyone avoided rits like the plague. Now that spirits are "un-nerfed" everybody feels free to finally give the profession a try. Why punish that?

And I don't know about anybody else, but my spirits tend to be very flimsy (especially under AoE) and rather disorganized. The idea of dropping spirits and running like hell makes me laugh. I have to direct my lazy spirits to get going by attacking what I want them to. And even then, a few will attack my target while the others attack something else. This doesn't scream "overpowered" to me.

tealspikes · Sep 08, 2010, 10:59 AM // 10:59

PvE is beyond saving at this point. Wait for GW2.

Cuilan · Sep 08, 2010, 01:33 PM // 13:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by tealspikes

PvE is beyond saving at this point. Wait for GW2.

That doesn't make any sense. Why would someone wait for a different game? That's not even a valid reason to not do something.

Ayuhmii Shanbwa · Sep 08, 2010, 02:18 PM // 14:18

SoS can be used once, in HM the recharge time may be good, as those mobs take more time to defeat
same with the other spirits

with 2 spirit spammers in 1 team, you gotta either change build, or use when the other's skills are recharging (which in HM is hard to see, as after a battle, the skills may be recharged, so the one who used first can use em again

just cuz spirits can be used as nice dmg dealers and a wall to let the team get less dmg, it still has weaknesses
look at the wanteds... or just the WiK enemies, some rangers have gaze of fury, which take care of 2 spirits from spirit spam

at least that happened with me everytime i fought em, 2 out of my 3 spirits from SoS got caught

let uw/fow and doa have some enemies with that skill, for all i care

anyway, spirit spam isnt as popular as it was right after the spirit buffs (from 2-3 sec casting time to less than 1)

people get bored of it mostly, so they find other builds to use

also, the OP here dont like that the game is kinda empty, well, most people left not just cuz of ursan or shadowform
and the reason that some pugs dont like other rits in their teams isnt cuz of SoS or anything, its their attitude, people only like to win lately, not all but alot only want 100% chance to make it

please dont blame certain builds/skills for the people/pugs who dont like non-popular builds

overpowered means you can beat most places just cuz of that build, but this build is just being popular, i'd say: let it be and buff some other profs

and if they dont do either, wait til people got sick of it and change their builds
without spirit spam it would be another build which would do the same, like letting pugs only take people with that kind of builds

face it, it'll be an endless cycle

oh yeah, the reason why spirits have 1 or less casting time is because rits were kinda bad back then (or just not as popular), should they nerf it back, rits wont be used much anymore, that'd be a waste of profession... and time

besides, i mostly see warriors being used anywhere in towns and outposts, and paragons are used alot too, why not kill em all? (sarcasm)

AngelWJedi · Sep 08, 2010, 02:18 PM // 14:18

i laugh when people say its hard to use a SoS solo build. but then again a lot of people cant kite worth a beep.

i dont see how SoS is over powered because it only lasts so long then you have to recast. try recasting in a mob of ice imps then see how "over powered it it". xD and besides the fact i rather get new content then a nerf/buff to skills.

Xiaquin · Sep 08, 2010, 02:59 PM // 14:59

I ran a balanced team in a HM mission with guildies, without using a spirit spammer. We made it to a tough spot and wiped. We could have sat down and re-tuned, but did we? No. My friend changed over to SoS and we steamrolled the mission.

It's a force multiplier, and I think it's beyond reason. While nobody has to run it, it did contribute to making PvE lazy. It's more of a crutch than anything. Chuck the strategy guide, just run spirits.

As for "killing" spamming, I wouldn't go that far. I think they should at least set fair cast times and increase the energy cost on some skills to better reflect the power. A group of spirits can be cheaper than one Bone Fiend, and probably raised in the same time. That makes no sense.

Daesu · Sep 08, 2010, 04:13 PM // 16:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xiaquin

I ran a balanced team in a HM mission with guildies, without using a spirit spammer. We made it to a tough spot and wiped. We could have sat down and re-tuned, but did we? No. My friend changed over to SoS and we steamrolled the mission.

It's a force multiplier, and I think it's beyond reason. While nobody has to run it, it did contribute to making PvE lazy. It's more of a crutch than anything. Chuck the strategy guide, just run spirits.

As for "killing" spamming, I wouldn't go that far. I think they should at least set fair cast times and increase the energy cost on some skills to better reflect the power. A group of spirits can be cheaper than one Bone Fiend, and probably raised in the same time. That makes no sense.

That is because necros have soul reaping and they gain energy very quickly in PvE, which can also be considered OP. So a more energy expensive spell on the necro makes sense. You can't expect all your necro spells to be as cheap as the other professions.

As for making PvE lazy, many things make PvE even lazier than spirit spamming. Cons for one, don't tell me spirit spamming is more OP than cons. If people complain that PvE is too easy then cons should be the first thing to go. PvE skills also make PvE lazy much more than spirit spamming.

Wierd that people tolerate all these overpowered things and yet asks for a nerf to spirit spamming. Obviously the mentality of some people is: Unless it is something that my characters can benefit from, otherwise we should nerf it to hell.